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Here is a list of seed a friend selected for me. He placed an order for me with his order to save on shipping and handling and to meet minimum orders I believe.

D intermedia Canada
D. linearis Giant Form Near Oliphant, Bruce County Ontario
D. capillaries “northern form, white flower” Milton Co., Florida
D. filiformis var tracyi Route 375, N of Sopchoppy, Franklin Co, Florida
S. flava “pubescent” Green Swamp, North Carolina X *S. flava “heavily veined, Green Swamp, North Carolina
S. leucophylla “giant” Franklin Co., Florida
S. leucophylla “large form mostly white top” off Route 66, Franklin Co., Florida
S. oreophila clone via U.S.A.
S. oreophila Boaz, Georgia
S. oreophila DeKalb Georgia
S. purpurea subsp. purpurea “seeds collected from red and veined plants” Moss Lake, Grey Co., Ontario,Canada
S. rubra subsp. gulfensis “all green form” Santa Rosa Co., Florida
S. rubra subsp. gulfensis “alba”
S. rubra subsp. wherryi “cultivated clone via U.S.A.”
S. minor Harleysville SC
S. minor Waycross Georgia
S. leucophylla "white with green veins" Baldwin Co., Alabama

I do not know his source as I didn't ask but he did mention the seed would come from Australia from a man named Alan and that the seed packs were $4 a piece.  

I need "age appropriate" growing instructions for 6th, 7th, and 8th grade kids for every seed listed above.  I found the site on growing CP plants from the web ring.  

I also could use a supply list of materials I will need to purchase for them, in addition to the seed which was already paid for, so that they can try to germinate the seed in a school room.  

I ordered doubles of the oreos and the leucos listed above to give as gifts to a few friends as well as for me to try to germinate one oreo and one leuco myself here at home. Any pearls of wisdom for me?
 
The only one that will probably be an issu for you is D. linearis. This guy is a fruit loop in terms of Drosera and actually does best under alkiline conditions. I have never grown it but I have heard that the best media is one of sand, perlite and come trace gypsum. You might want to try contacting Tamlin for some more on this guy.

All the others are also likely to need a stratification to ensure good germination. Take a paper towel, wet it and then ring it out really well. Open it back up and place the seed on it. Fold it and place it in a plastic bag and drop the bag in your fridge for a month minimum (2-3 is better.)

I know who the original source is. I do not want to start a debate but I feel it only fair to warn you that many people feel that this person does not throw out seed after it gets too old so some of the stuff you recieve might be 2, 3, 4 or more years old. This can have an effect on germination.

Also, one last thing, S. oreophila DeKalb Georgia has to be a wrong label. I live in DeKalb County, GA and it is 100% city. The closest oreo stand is 70+ miles away from DeKalb Co. I believe that it is probably DeKalb Alabama but do not quote me on that.
 
Yes, with this seed, if you don't get germination, it may not be any fault of yours in sowing. Just bear that in mind.

You sure got a long list there! And some nice ones. You have a lot of plants with "location data" and that is very important. Make sure seed of each variety is sown separately and is correctly and fully labeled. Keep those labels with each plant once they are large enough to transfer and be planted.

Methods of sowing varies between growers but generically speaking, most people use peat for germinating drosera and many use sphagnum moss for sarracenia. But like I said, everyone has their own method.

As Pyro mentioned, the sarracenia seed will probably need "stratification" before sowing. Stratification is keeping the seeds in a cold, moist environment for 1-3 months prior to sowing (as would happen naturally outside...seeds drop in the fall, remain cool and damp through winter, germinate in spring with warmer weather). You might want to ask a specific question on that in the sarracenia forum.

I have successfully germinated drosera seed with moist peat in a semi-sealed plastic container. "To go" salad bar containers have worked nicely for me. You can see through them to check on your seeds. For sarracenia I have used finely milled (in a blender) longfibered sphagnum moss. I moisten the milled fiber, fill a plastic container 1/3 full with it, sprinkle my seed on the top, cover it and toss it in the fridge for a 1-2 months. Then I take it out, and put in a warm place. You do not need much light at this stage. Only after seed has germinated do you need to have a lot of light.

I'm sure there are others here with good tips and different methods. This is what has worked for me.

You will need germinating containers, peat moss, longfibered sphagnum moss and pure water, a cool place for stratification and plant labels.

I was just wondering...is it legal to sell Oreo seeds? I guess laws are different in Oz. There are strict laws here regarding selling/tranferring Oreophilas but I don't know if it applies to seed as well. Just curious.

Good luck!

Suzanne
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Well.. technically CITES I plants includes seed.  So it should not be crossing international borders any more than plants.

Sarracenia listed in appendix I
S. rubra ssp. alabamensis and ssp. jonesii
S. oreophila


My personal suggestion would be to spend the money to join the ICPS for $25 and then get seed from their seedbank. At least it should be relatively fresh. Fortunately Sarracenia seed is fairly durable and long lived.

T
 
Tony raises a good point about ICPS. And they are cheaper to boot
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I am already a member of ICPS.  They are only $1 a pack but they will not charge an educational institution.  That made me feel uncomfortable as there have got to be other organizations that are out there that don't have anyone funding them and I looked at their quantities and their stock seemed so low so I figured leave that seed for other schools.  I placed this order for the seed listed above with my friend to get seed for the kids and a little for me personally and a few packs to give as gifts because I was too embarrassed to ask for anything here since that auction was over and I saw the prices those plants auctioned went for and felt really uncomfortable.  I already knew these plants were expensive as I bought quite a few that are no longer alive. The bottom line is that one man has already sent me really nice plants and another man is sending me plants to help replace what I bought for the school that was trashed by the squirrels before I fenced in my bog and I was so grateful to be offered anything that I didn't want to come back and even suggest I wanted anything else as people are beyond generous here and nobody would even take my money for shipping and handling so that made me feel raunchy. And two other members from the Terra forums here are sending me two different types of seed which I have no doubt will be fresh.  I placed another order for seed with an organization that I don't even remember what the name was a while ago and I never got my seed from a month ago and I evidently didn't save the address where I mailed the check along with my seed selections so there goes another $100.  Ugh.  So what I am gathering is that this other person, "Alan", is going to send me seed that is so old its viability is questionable and now I am going to have a teacher with a bunch of kids sitting there looking at baggies and trays of nothingness other than soil?  Great. I am beginning to feel as if I am darned if I do and darned if I don't.

I guess I am going to break down and place an order with ICPS for anything they don't have.  

Where do I get longfibered sphagnum moss?

Thanks for your help.  What's the deal on D. linearis?  Are we talking a double dormancy seed?  Does it maybe need scarification or something?
 
actually some of the plants on that auction went for way more then they are worth. basically some of us were just donating money to the cause and recieved a plant for the donation. alot of us here on the forms have no problems giving away are extra stuff its just gotten dang near to cold fo me to send you my extras plus it sounds as if you already have recieved what i would have sent. good luck with your class. it sounds like a fun project
 
Hi Laura,

Just a guess but believe they're ordering from
Allan Lowrie of Austrialia (author of Carnivorous Plants of Australia Vol. 1-3)
He has a "Huge" seed list available but as others have said germination rates can be variable.
I have had Sarracenia seed several years old germinate but stratification (cold, moist treatment is needed) prior to germinating (unless you have just out of the pod seed).

I have ordered multiple times from the ICPS seedbank and they strongly support education institutions. They kindly offered some free seed when I did a Carnivorous Plant demonstration for an elementary school.

Good luck with your bog. I've had my own squirrel issues this year and had a raccoon snack on a beautiful Sarracenia leucophylla.

Kirk
Fitchburg, Massachusetts
Member of New England Carnivorous Plant Society www.necps.org
 
Whoops sorry....

I purchase Long-fibred sphagnum at Home Depot (not Green Moss as that can be toxic to plants). It's about $4-5 for a small and $20-24 for a large one.
 
  • #10
[b said:
Quote[/b] (LauraZ5 @ Oct. 29 2004,1:26)]So what I am gathering is that this other person, "Alan", is going to send me seed that is so old its viability is questionable and now I am going to have a teacher with a bunch of kids sitting there looking at baggies and trays of nothingness other than soil?  
Not necessarily. Not all the seed on Allen's list is old. And, as others have stated, some seed (like Sarr seed) is more robust. Odds are some of it will germinate I just would not expect 100% germination.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Great. I am beginning to feel as if I am darned if I do and darned if I don't.

I wouldn't feel that way. You are doing your best and that is what is most important.
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[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
Where do I get longfibered sphagnum moss?

Kirk mentioned HD but I also find it at Lowes. Look for Orchid Moss. Or just try an online search.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
Thanks for your help. What's the deal on D. linearis? Are we talking a double dormancy seed? Does it maybe need scarification or something

No though it does need a longer dormancy, being native to the great lakes region. The deal with D. linearis is that it is not your typical CP. Most CPs like acidic soil (pH less than 7) which is why we use peat moss and LFS as media for them. D. linearis grows in soil that is alkaline (pH greater tha 7) so peat is somewhat toxic to it, hence the very different media I suggested.
 
  • #11
Ooooooooh, I wouldnt reccomend D.linearis at all.....
Its hard to grow. And germinate

I also wouldnt reccoemd S.leucophylla and S.minor.
They coem from hot places in the U.S and are not very hardy.

I odnt knwo about the hardiness of all the rubras, tho rubra subsp. jonesii is very hardy.
 
  • #12
Hey Laura

Why don't you make a post on the Trade Forum?  Give a little explanation of your project. Describe the weather/temp/seasons your bogs will be growing in and ask for donations of appropriate plants and/or seeds for your project.  Then post your address and see what might arrive.  
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People would be free to give or not as they feel.  And you wouldn't have to worry as much about old seed.  The kind and generous membership here are always giving seeds and plants away so why not direct some to an educational project?

Give it a try and don't feel bad about taking the plants or seeds.  All you need to do is sometime in the future, when you can propagate your plants, you give plant material away three times and ask that the receiver does the same.  That keeps the cycle going.  
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Also, if you have concerns about some plants surviving dormancy, you can always leave your plants potted, but sink the pots in the bog. That way, they will look natural but come really cold weather, you can always pull the pots up and store the plants in a more protected area til spring.

Suzanne
 
  • #13
Oh...one more thing.  I've seen Spanish moss sold as "Orchid Moss" so just make sure what you are buying is longfibered sphagnum moss (LFS) which is totally different than Spanish moss. Canadian is good and so is Chilean. Wisconsin tends to be rather rooty and weedy.
 
  • #14
The DeKalb county oreophila will be from DeKalb county Alabama. The oreos from there are nicely heavily veined.

There's no 'right' way to sow the sarracenia seeds but the general consensus is that they grow better in live sphagnum moss. The downside of this though is that it can easily smother the seedlings, even up to a year or so after germination. An easier method is to use 100% moss peat/perlite in a 2:1 mixture, or live sphagnum moss with a thin layer of peat on the top.

Personally I stratify by wrapping the seeds in wet paper towel, covering with foil and putting them in the fridge for exactly 5 weeks.
 
  • #15
I know a lot of folks use the paper towel method. I like my way mostly because I don't have to transfer the seeds anywhere else to germinate them. I can take the container out of the fridge and its ready to go. I can leave the seedlings in the container until they are large enough to transfer to a small pot. And the milled sphag doesn't tend to regenerate and grow so the seedlings are safe.

But everyone has their favored way of doing things. As long as it works, it doesn't really matter.
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You could perhaps add some scientific interest to the project by trying stratification in several different ways and see if one way produces germination more quickly than another...or if the germination rate is higher.
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  • #16
Hi Laura,

D. linearis is a difficult Drosera species. Although I have not cultivated it, I have spoken with growers who have it growing successfully, but it is always outdoors in a suitable habitat. The problem is in the overwintering of the yearlings. Like the more arctic forms of D. alglica the plants form hibernacula in the fall to overwinter. In the spring, typically, these open into active growth, but a month later they inevitably reform hibernacula, weaken and die.

I think other than this species most of the others will present no greater or lesser difficulty if you have a goood growing protocol in place, and this is a great place to learn it.

In general, CP of all genera want high humidity to germinate. You can read my "take" on seed sowing in the Article forum under seed sowing. My protocol works well for me, and although I predominently grow Drosera it should apply to most CP's. Asking more specific questions on the appropriate forum for the genus will also bring many tips.

Yes, there are some issues with seed freshness in Lowrie's catalog. He obviously does not update his master list ( some items have remained on there for over a decade), but I hear good reports from items ordered from his update list. I can't say more than what I have heard though since I will not do business with him. The issue of Lowrie's seed freshness, proper ID and his wild collecting of Australian Drosera tubers is a rather hotly debated topic on public forums and I do not care to become involved with either his business or the debate regarding the ethics surrounding it.

One of the best efforts a person can make is toward educating future generations to the wonder and NEED that CP have. These fragile species need all the help they can get. I believe that the only way they will survive as something other than images in a book or on a tube is if the successive generations of good growers steward the plants. Teaching the cultivation requirements of these species, and also the good habits of proper recording of the plants is a good work, and one that members here unanimously support.

We are all in it together for the fun of the plants, but also as serious stewards of some very threatened species. There is a nobility in caring for these plants that is unmatched in horticulture. I believe that the finest and best qualities can be found in most Cper's, and the best of these qualities is generosity and sharing. This is why forums like this are such a fine gift (Thanks again, Phillip).

What I am trying to say is don't feel badly about taking something for free. It is to a higher end and a greater good. If everone shared openely and freely, just think of how we could spread these plants! If you teach anything, I encourage you teach this ethic. A rare thing can engender 2 responses: one is to protect and nurture it. The other response is to capitalize on it's rarity. By the laws of supply and demand, one school wants to see it spread far and wide, the other would just as soon see the material kept rare since it brings greater profit. Most of us here are of the same mind. We want this material to spread to as many growers as we can encourage and support to take up the Stewardship. Between us, there is one Collection held in trust. The only thing that puts limits on what you can hope to have and grow are only considerations of your own space and skills! We work hard at keeping money out of the equation, and focusing on out mutual deep seated love and regard for these species.
If you have the space, the skills and the love then all will come to you, and with blessings!

I wish you the best in teaching, and hope you inspire another generation to carry on the work and the art of CP cultivation.
 
  • #17
Tee he... I am not the teacher.  I would best be described as her "lab assistant".  I do work in the community with kids though and focus is on exotic species control, management, and eradication. I definitely do like wetlands!  

I am over the Alan seed order mess. What is done is done and I would have never placed an order had I known he was suspected of wild collecting which is a cardinal sin in my book.  The age of the seed doesn't exactly thrill me either considering I would have liked the kids to have fresh seed with which to work.  

The D.linearis seed I will keep and play with myself here at home if it comes in.   In addition to my little acid bog, I have a small fen at home that will meet that plant's requirements.  I only have sedges and a few rushes in the fen which is fine so there is space to add a few linearis.  Those seeds, should they even germinate, won't go to the school based on what I have learned here.  I played with the potential hydrogen by adding white pine needles to the sand/sphagnum mix I made for the school and toyed with the idea of adding a tince of extremely diluted vinegar to further increase the acidity of their planting medium but figured it best to wait until the teacher tested the mix to see what it was at first.  Everything they have is going to have a PH of somewhere in the 5-6 range I suspect which may be ideal for the plants we received but not so good for any D. linearis.  

I'm thinking I will print Tamlin Dawnstar's seed sowing thread and this thread and hand them in their entirety to the science teacher. She'll love getting all this great germination information!  Sure will save her a tremendous amount of time on line researching the seeds ordered.

I will post a request for a few things sooner or later but I am not going to post a blanket request with an address here in the trade section as I can guarantee we'd get more than enough plants and seed to start our own cottage industry. I base this statement on what we were sent this past week by ONLY 3 people. Last night, I came home and saw two boxes that had been delivered here. Holy cow is about all I can say. At the school, we will now have a "Littlest Shop Of Horrors" in addition to the "Little Shop Of Horrors" because of the gifts.  The inside school's "Littlest Shop" will have almost 20 tropical CP plants for the classroom including VFTs and one Vodoo Lily that is sure to be a big hit thanks to 3 people here. They will look awesome all lined up by the windows!  We also will have at least 10 hardy CPs that will be replanted outside in the school's "Little Shop Of Horrors" next spring. A few people from Terra forums are sending fresh seed to us. Another person offered to send more seed (I saw the pm and I will get back to you) and another offered to send sarracenia plants later on this winter when they divide their plants. The classroom can only handle x number of plants and we have to consider our skill set which is virtually non existent other than that which we are learning here. I really truly do not want any rare plants as if they die, I will feel guilt.  Maybe in a few years I will personally try some but it is doubtful the teacher will want to try any, I know her pretty well now.  Unfortunately there are those darn space limitations as they really want to try their hands at germination to get plants for outside the school. Based on the seed I bought and the 6 different types that will be sent by members, that is going to mean 20+ baggies in the frig in the teacher's lounge and then additional space in the classroom after they are cold stratified.  I suspect the classroom will go with the damp paper towel method while I will go with the method described by PlantAKiss when I try to germinate the oreo and leuco seeds from good ole boy Alan who should have his hands cracked with a nice big fat ruler if he is wild collecting.
 
  • #18
A question For Plant A Kiss please-
I looked high and low and came up empty handed as far as "long fibered sphagnum moss".  The Home Depots/Menards/WalMarts and other big box stores in my area do not carry it.  Unfortunately, neither do the nurseries and greenhouses. I bought this bale that at least states it is sphagnum moss and that it allegedly is Wisconsin's finest.  Can I use this for germination? I also do not have a blender so maybe I can crunch it in my hands?
84fb9adf.jpg

And these are some of the containers I bought. Are these what you were referring to?  The small ones I thought the teacher could use for cold stratification seeds that she would put in a frig... less likely to get thrown out of the frig in the teacher's lounge in an official looking food container. The other ones are for the sphagnum mix for seeds that don't need cold stratification. Am I on the right track?
45721c58.jpg

If the sphagnum moss I picked up will not work, I need an online source. Thanks much, Laura
 
  • #19
That moss cna be used for germiantion(add water to it, it iwll start to grow and eventally turn green!)
Yes, youc an break it up with your hands.
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those containers do look O.K to me, I owuld howeevr, suggest that you drill holes in the bottom.
Dino

P.S
I know Im not PAK but I think this is what she owuld have anwsered.
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  • #20
It looks to be the right moss. Just be sure you remove the twigs and fossilized human remains before use.

I am extremely happy with the response of our members to your request.

I am going to write to our local school district and see if I can interest them in a similar project for next spring.....get 'em while they are young!
 
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