So Ceph Stratification Is Over...

[Vbkid]

So today was the 8 week mark for my pots of cephalotus seed i nthe fridge. They are on the surface of a peat/sand mix and appear to have made it through mold free.
I just want to make sure that my current plans are suitable now.
I plan on putting them under my T5 fixture still in their bags about a foot from the lamps. I don't think it will be too hot but wanted soem other opinions. I can also put them unto my 2 T8 fixtures that have considerably less light if temps are an issue.
Thoughts and/or suggestiosn are greatly appreciated!

 

[BigBella]

That arrangement should work out just fine; just ensure that nothing gets cooked . . .

 

[Mikey3288]

Agreed, everything sounds good. Do you have any holes in the bag or are you opening the top a little bit? I would just monitor them daily and make sure no mold develops or live sphagnum starts taking over the pot. Good luck!!

Just curious - which cultivar are you growing?

 

[fredg]

Just curious - which cultivar are you growing?

You can't grow a Cephalotus cultivar from seed

 

[Vbkid]

You can't grow a Cephalotus cultivar from seed

I *could* it's just not very likely. In any case, I have some Eden Black x Self, HG x Everything, and VG x everything. I currently don't have the bags open, was mroe afraid of stuff getting INTO the bag to cause mold. Thoughts?

 

[RL7836]

I plan on putting them under my T5 fixture still in their bags about a foot from the lamps. I don't think it will be too hot but wanted soem other opinions.

Ime, an accurate thermometer trumps an opinion every time.

 

[fredg]

You can't grow a Cephalotus cultivar from seed

I *could* it's just not very likely.

I'm afraid you can't propagate either 'Eden Black' or 'Hummer's Giant' from seed. If you doubt this please read the cultivar registrations.

Cephalotus 'Eden Black' :- Propagation: vegetatively via leaf or rhizome cuttings or by division

Cephalotus 'Hummer's Giant' :- Propagation: vegetative only

 

[Mikey3288]

*gasp* wait, really? I've seen BigBella have several self pollinated cultivars and crossing cultivars together to produce seed. Do these seeds just produce regular Cephalotus then?

 

[fredg]

*gasp* wait, really? I've seen BigBella have several self pollinated cultivars and crossing cultivars together to produce seed. Do these seeds just produce regular Cephalotus then?

Each will be an individual clone. Whatever is produced cannot be called the original cultivar name however.

 

[Vbkid]

Each will be an individual clone. Whatever is produced cannot be called the original cultivar name however.

They won't be clones. While all the genetic material will be from the 'one' parent, some alleles will double up and some lost in each individual offspring.
And my comment on the low probability of it being the same cultivar earlier comes from the definition of a cultivar which is any plant that is identical in description to that of the cultivar, some brred true, most do not (as in this case, they do not) but always the chance an offspring can wi nthe genetic lottery.

 

[Whimgrinder]

I find it endlessly entertaining to witness these arguments over what a clone/cultivar is or is not. Most amusing.

 

[Vbkid]

The clone part isn't an argument right?
The offsrping won't be anywhere near genetically identical.

 

[mylesG]

yes but thats not what he meant by clone. every seedling can be called a clone but that is not to say that the plants are clones of the parent plant, just that they are all different and unique (even if they appear nearly identical).

 

[fredg]

Thank you Myles

 

[Vbkid]

It is entirely possible that I am simply ignorant of that definition, but can I be pointed anywhere where it is definded that way?
Really just want to correct myself if I'm wrong.

 

[Plant Planter]

I find it endlessly entertaining to witness these arguments over what a clone/cultivar is or is not. Most amusing.

I wouldn't say amusing, but it's interesting to see people quibbling back and forth over totally irrelevant topics that are pointless.

ANYWAY, let's get back to the topic at hand.
What's their humidity right now?

 

[fredg]

I wouldn't say amusing, but it's interesting to see people quibbling back and forth over totally irrelevant topics that are pointless.

ANYWAY, let's get back to the topic at hand.
What's their humidity right now?

The irrelevent pointless topics are just that until you are sold a Cephalotus 'Hummers Giant' or 'Eden Black' that it turns out later were grown from seed and therefore not those cultivars.

 

[Whimgrinder]

Each will be an individual clone. Whatever is produced cannot be called the original cultivar name however.

To elaborate, any time sexual reproduction is involved in the generation of new individuals (growing from seed), the resulting individuals cannot be referred to as "cultivars" until one (or more) has been selected as special and assigned cultivar status. Using the term "cultivar" to refer to seed-grown plants, regardless of the parents used, is totally erroneous.

As for the term "clone", it can be used to describe any individual, whether a named cultivar or not, but its application is best limited to describing asexually reproduced divisions of specific individuals. Yes, you can say that each seedling grown from seed is its own "clone", but the popular usage (misuse?) of the term in that way has led many to misunderstand its meaning and therefore we see confusion - not unlike what we've seen in this thread.

To make it perfectly clear, if you grow seedlings from C. follicularis 'Eden Black' (a named cultivar), you cannot call the seedlings 'Eden Black', because they are genetically unique plants every one, and therefore they are not representatives of the 'Eden Black" clone, but are distinct offspring. You can select seedlings bred from 'Eden Black' and assign them as registered cultivars, but they must be given unique names to identify them as new cultivars.

 

[Vbkid]

While, for many reasons, I would never refer to a seed grown ceph as the same cultivar of it's parents, I do wnat people reading this to get a full picture of what a cultivar is.
From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultivar
"Members of a particular cultivar are not necessarily genetically identical. The Cultivated Plant Code emphasizes that different cultivated plants may be accepted as different cultivars, even if they have the same genome, while cultivated plants with different genomes may be regarded as the same cultivar."

But, with particular importance to cepahlotus...

"Some cultivars "come true from seed", retaining their distinguishing characteristics when grown from seed. Such plants are termed a "variety", "selection" or "strain" but these are ambiguous and confusing words that are best avoided. In general, asexually propagated cultivars grown from seeds produce highly variable seedling plants, and should not be labelled with, or sold under, the parent cultivar's name."

 

[mcmcnair]

What Vbkid is saying just above me is concurrent with what is taught at EVERY university that teaches horticulture. Here is the basic gist in case somebody didnt want to read all that though.

A cultivar is a name given to a plant that is displaying unique characteristics from the original species of that plant. If seed is collected from the designated cultivar the offspring will be genetically different from the parent cultivar. However, plants grown from that seed that display the SAME unique traits as the parent plant CAN be called the same cultivar.

Hope that helps.