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Which is C. 'Eden Black'?

Which plant below is C. 'Eden Black'?
Currently, there is an auction on flea bay for a tiny Cephalotus 'Eden Black'. Let's play a little game and see if growers here can guess correctly. One of the three plants in the picture below is a genuine C. 'Eden Black', traceable to the originator, Stephen Morley. They grow directly next to each other, under the same conditions. Place your guesses people!
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Closeups of the contenders:
16046453989_8d751d5dbb_c.jpg

16045055698_20ffab5d49_c.jpg

15612718583_c2096af31d_c.jpg
 
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I'm going to say plant #3. Not because of the color, but because you have it in a conspicuously larger pot with what appears to be a different, maybe more painstakingly mixed, media. Otherwise, they all look the same to me..
 
ohhhh I wanna play, I knows nuttin about EB, so me clueless
I feel like I'm about to play three card monte and you see me wearing an I love NY shirt....

hmmmm 3 seems too obvious, #2 seems the best fed

#2
 
No fun if it's not a trick question and all three are C. 'Eden Black'
 
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Its obvious, really - its the expensive one!
 
Number one. Because the M in the lid of the pitcher stands for Morley.
 
No. 1

1. Slowest grower
2. Precious topping of live sphagnum moss

ROTFLMAO
 
Im going with number one as well.
 
  • #10
I'm gonna guess 3 based on color, and assuming that the plant was propagated from vegetative material. If it is a clone traceable to the original it should be darker when the other 2 grown in the same conditions are not, at least I would think. If they are seed grown it's anyone's guess which one is EB.
 
  • #11
If I guess right do I win the plant?
 
  • #12
 
  • #13
This is a good illustration showing how growing conditions can alter the appearances of plants. In conditions with brighter light, all of these plants will appear differently than they do in these photos, showing darker coloration and so on.
 
  • #14
f they are seed grown it's anyone's guess which one is EB.

Seed grown plants from EB selfed seeds that Stephen Morley has been distributing for years, are not Eden Black. In fact, I have seen grower's incorrectly label plants from BigBella's EB selfed clones, that were purchased from flea bay, as Eden Black. A word of caution for those who are willing to sell their first born for this plant, that there is already some confusion.

In my collection Eden Black is nothing special. Amongst its 3 dozen neighbors, Eden Black's coloration is around the median.
 
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  • #15
for some reason plant 3 looks very... "charles brewer" to me.
 
  • #16
Many people have assumed - erroneously - that seed-grown plants originating from C. 'Eden Black' ARE C. 'Eden Black', which they are not. C. 'Eden Black' is a single clone. If someone offers to sell you a seed-grown plant under this name, they are attempting to deceive you. If you buy one under this pretext, expecting to receive C. 'Eden Black', you're acting on misinformation.
 
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  • #17
intensity of coloration or size is a poor standard for cultivar status imho, be it Cephalotus or Heliamphora....

you're paying for the known pedigree more than a defining characteristic

Forget HG, I want a "pokie22" ceph!!, those naughty girls get 4"+
 
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  • #18
(unless size is truly unique of course)
:p
 
  • #19
intensity of coloration or size is a poor standard for cultivar status imho, be it cephalotus or heliamphora....

Exactly! That is really the whole point in this thread. Cephalotus is not stable and respond to individual growing conditions. Making Cephalotus cultivars invalid and pointless.
 
  • #20
intensity of coloration or size is a poor standard for cultivar status imho, be it Cephalotus or Heliamphora....
Exactly! That is really the whole point in this thread. Cephalotus is not stable and respond to individual growing conditions. Making Cephalotus cultivars invalid and pointless.
I think a large part of the issue is one of unrestrained/unrealistic expectations. Basically, people see the pics & expect to have an exact duplicate no matter how they grow the plant. That is unrealistic.

However, having a plant that has the genetic makeup to truly be different in some sense, is probably worthwhile as a cultivar candidate (although the criteria is still debatable). I grew Cephalotus 'Hummer's Giant' for many years & never got a pitcher as large as Jen's. Does that mean it shouldn't be a cultivar? Even though this clone clearly has the potential to be larger than most others. Also, the C. 'Hummer's Giant' clone rarely got very dark for me. Another clone "Czech Giant" would get almost black under the exact same conditions & media. If C. 'Eden Black' has the potential to get as dark or even more so than the "Czech Giant" clone I grew - doesn't that show that it has different genetic material that has a trait, that when grown in the right conditions, can express itself?

I get it, that because some traits are not always apparent or obvious & may need specific environmental conditions to be visible - some people will be upset. Because of this, it's also easy for fraudsters to sell fake clones at inflated prices (reinforcing the need for provenance).
 
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