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USDA Permit Madness

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I need a new small seed permit so I thought I'd try and just send it online, its 2013 right? We should be able to do that by now.

Well not so much, after a few hours (yes hours) getting the account setup, lots of overcomplicated instructions with a few "wait 10m, 20m" times. A very complex password system I finally get into there system and can start working my way around the menu's. There it is! PPQ Form 587! Yay!! I win!!........Umm...I signed up for level 2 access...after another hour of looking around/reading....I have to physically go into an office in down town so they can verify who I am....or just drop the completed form in the mail....

Looks like its paper + USPS for me! Atleast this way should be painless.

Gotta love the government....
 
I went through that about 2 years ago, i've still got my permits and everything but I let them lapse I think. Going to the office was a pain though
 
That's my point, if I just print out the form and mail it off I don't have to go anywhere. Forget all this fancy technology :crazy:
 
Going to the office is totally pointless too. All they do is enter all the info you already gave them. Also, don't expect them to be able to answer ANY questions you may have pertaining to actually using the permits.
 
I'm just after a new permit for next year so snail mail will work just fine. I'm just amazed by this, although I shouldn't be considering the mess that US importing is.

All this stuff is just so silly, I can tell them I want to import any and all legal seeds from France but I can't tell them I want to import all legal Nep seeds worldwide. I really have to specify each location individually?

If I'm reading everything right and you have a permit you will not be fined for importing the illegal stuff, they just destroy it. GOGO CITES! Destroy the indangered stuff instead of finding it a proper legal home. But importing legal stuff without a permit well that's potential jail time.

Who gave these @%$$#$ power again?

I've been reading too much government stuff today :crazy:

It does look like CITIES is allowing Nep pollen without certs. excluding khasiana and rajah

a) seeds (including seedpods of Orchidaceae), spores and pollen (including pollinia). The exemption does not apply to seeds from Cactaceae spp. exported from Mexico, and to seeds from Beccariophoenix madagascariensis and Neodypsis decaryi exported from Madagascar
 
I listed every country I could even think of possibly importing plants from on my paperwork. Same as genera, my list is huge. I just wanted to cover all bases.
 
Turn around time for ePermits (level 2 access) from authorization to receiving your paperwork is 11 days. By paper up to 30 days. Same for renewals, additions or changes. My original application was for only 4 countries and several taxa. Online status my permits says all applicable taxon and countries. I wanted to add more countries to my original application but was told this was not necessary as the online permit was for all. This may not be the case with paper only permits.
 
If its not a problem can you tell me what the wording is for your countries online? Maybe if I print that on the mail in form they would take it. I'm done with seeds from this year so I won't need this until spring/fall of next year. Plenty of time to resend it if they don't like it :)

My closest office is 45m away in an area I would never go to otherwise.
 
The wording is not an option on the online forms so I doubt they'll accept it on the paper forms. You can try it but don't blame me if the forms come back unapproved or rejected and you have to wait another 30 days reapplying.
 
  • #10
Hmmm - don't recall the snail-mail option - I thought everyone had to go to an office. :scratch:

You'll get your paperwork back and find out you still need to go :lol:
 
  • #11
I listed every country I could even think of possibly importing plants from on my paperwork. Same as genera, my list is huge. I just wanted to cover all bases.

i left out orchids and neps because of the CITES issues figured it wasn't worth it, but shotgunned everything else
 
  • #12
i left out orchids and neps because of the CITES issues figured it wasn't worth it, but shotgunned everything else

Neps seeds are CITIES II #4 except 2 species which are still CITIES I so seeds are fair game and have been for a while except those 2 species. I just noticed pollen is included in #4, did not see that last year.

You have been able to mail off permits for years it just takes a lot longer.
 
  • #13
Just to clarify since this is a murky area of the law.

valid from 12 June 2013

Nepenthes spp. #4 (Except the species included in Appendix I)

Once you click on the link for the #4 you get

#4 All parts and derivatives, except:
a) seeds (including seedpods of Orchidaceae), spores and pollen (including pollinia). The exemption does not apply to seeds from Cactaceae spp. exported from Mexico, and to seeds from Beccariophoenix madagascariensis and Neodypsis decaryi exported from Madagascar;
b) seedling or tissue cultures obtained in vitro, in solid or liquid media, transported in sterile containers;
c) cut flowers of artificially propagated plants;
d) fruits, and parts and derivatives thereof, of naturalized or artificially propagated plants of the genus Vanilla (Orchidaceae) and of the family Cactaceae;
e) stems, flowers, and parts and derivatives thereof, of naturalized or artificially propagated plants of the genera Opuntia subgenus Opuntia and Selenicereus (Cactaceae); and
f) finished products of Euphorbia antisyphilitica packaged and ready for retail trade.

Appendix I species are Nepenthes khasiana and Nepenthes rajah.

It looks like you can Fax the form also! So you can mail it or fax it, but you can not e-mail it. If you want to use the website you have to visit a physical building first!
 
  • #14
Just got around to finishing off the 587 and its going in the mail today.

Listed on the back of the 587 forum under #3 for seeds it says "If the list of species and/or countries of origin is long, you may enter 'eligible taxa.'"

So under country of origin I did. Lets see what I get back in a month. According to the statement above you could submit eligible taxa under both species and countries, allowing you to impost anything eligible from anywhere with one simply line. Something to try later when I get around to the vegetable 587.
 
  • #15
Be sure that when you fill out the PPQ form that you find where it says "phytosanitary exempt" under ssl. You can get the one without, more applicable to plants, and if you get stuff in they may tell you that it does not cover those, and you cannot get a phyto after the fact. But they might let you reapply...Best to get what you need. Lots of the permits cover many actions, and your best bet (I think) is to find a station with good customer service. Then you can call and ask questions prior to importing - maybe. And check on stuff for arrival if they are cool with that. I recomment the Los Angeles Hawthorne station.
 
  • #16
Think we are talking about different forms, there is no "phytosanitary" on this form, I'm just after the small seed lot permit. I'm not intending to import anything that requires a cert. I looked through the CITIES stuff this morning and was surprised at the lack of CPs on the list. Most of the stuff on the list was CITIES II #4 (seeds allowed without certs).

Either way, its out of my hands and into the postal service.
 
  • #17
Got the permit earlier this week, so about 2 months from mailing to received.
 
  • #18
The gubermint shutdown may have been a factor in the time frame.
 
  • #19
Very well could have been, I've planned way ahead so its not a problem.

They did give me a blanket permit for all legal seeds/countries instead of listing them out.
 
  • #20
Apologies for resurrecting this thread several months later...

Following the advice here, I avoided the online application and was surprised by the fast turnaround time on my snail-mail application. I got a blanket permit for eligible taxa and a bunch of shipping labels.

RSS, have you used your permit yet?

I want to buy some stylidium seed from Oz. Such a cool little genus but hard to track down here, except for S. debile. Two different sellers, both of whom seem reputable, assured me that all I would need to do is scan and email them a copy of the permit and the shipping label. Has anyone done this? I don't have any moral scruples scanning the labels, I just don't want men in black to show up at my door...

Once the seeds clear customs/inspection, how have you arranged to get them? Do you have to drive to the inspection center to pick them up?
 
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