FAMOUS Nepenthes Fertilizers

[MrAga73]

Hello to everyone!
I wanted to try Miracid in order to fertilize my Nepenthes or at least some of them that are a little too slow.
Looking on the net I found 2 versions of Miracid that makes me some confusions....which on I should buy?
And are those ones the right ones?
I post here 2 pics....
One of them acts like an acidifer also and the other not.
Some of you can describe me these 2 products?
Have you experiences?
Thank you!

Mr_Aga
Milan - ITALY

 

[Clint]

Use the second one because it's not as concentrated. You can tell because it says for Orchids, ferns and gardenias.

 

[MrAga73]

Ehmm..sure...but what is the problem if it is concentrated?
I can always use them in minor doses as recomended,don't you think?
Did you never use it?
Thanks!

Mr_Aga
Milan - ITALY

 

[Clint]

I have indeed. Long time ago. Now i'm just using schultz.

You can dilute it even further if you want to. Go with the first if you want. Using the second is just what I personally would do.

I don't see why you say one acidifies the soil and one doesn't. If they are both for acid loving plants then they must both lower the PH. The first one looks like it would be more acidic given the genera of plants listed on the front.

 

[MrAga73]

Hello JustLikeAPill!
from what I have read....the PRO SELCT VERSION ( first picture at TOP ) has this description :
30-10-10 specially formulated for azid loving plants. Great for Azalea, Camellia, Rhododendron, all Evergreens and the such.


While the second product ( picture at bottom ) has this description :
America's favorite for azaleas, rhododendrons and all evergreens! Soil acidifier and plant food with trace elements. Unique 30-10-10 formulation plus chelated iron, copper, zinc and manganese and other trace elements. Remarkable 3-in-1 plant treatment: feeds, ironizes, acidifies. Produces beautiful azaleas, rhododendrons and evergreens. For all acid-loving plants.

Understood?
It seems so that the SECOND product with add on of trace elements should be more functional.You are right! The producs are similar and I did make a miss take.
Thanks!

Mr_Aga
Milan - ITALY

 

[Clint]

Well, now we know lol.

They are both the same in macronutrients. Buy the second.

 

[glider14]

Quote[/b] ]Unique 30-10-10 formulation plus chelated iron, copper, zinc and manganese and other trace elements.

those are toxic to neps....

Alex

 

[Clint]

Duh, why didn't I think of that last night? lol

He's right.

 

[quogue]

Savage Garden says to stay away from Miracid for Neps. What's the stuff people use for Neps? Orchid fertilizer? I dunno, I just feed mine...

 

[Outsiders71]

Freeze dried shrimp ftw.

 

[tonyc]

Quote[/b] ]Unique 30-10-10 formulation plus chelated iron, copper, zinc and manganese and other trace elements.

those are toxic to neps....

Alex

Do you have a source for that statement? I thought all those elements were essential to any sort of plant life.
Of course, if the plant OD's on any one or two of them.....

 

[nepenthes_ak]

Nep's and most CP's live in nutrient deprived soil's you have to rember that. and alot of minerals and nutrience are washed away as well!

 

[tonyc]

Quote[/b] ]Nep's and most CP's live in nutrient deprived soil's you have to rember that. and alot of minerals and nutrience are washed away as well!

Yes, they live without those nutrients being present in the soil.
That isn't the same as saying those 'nutrients' are 'toxic'.

 

[glider14]

This thread....
Alex

 

[MrAga73]

quogue?!?! ]
What? Who? Why?
Savage Garden tell you to stay far? But why?
There are other voices of famous sellers that tells that Miracid is the best fertilizer discovered untill now.
JustLikeAPill] :
You didn't pay attention to the trace elements? So...than your final decision is again to buy the FIRST one and NOT the second one ?
Ahaha..what a big confusion!
Is there any who can answer to this?
Bye!

Mr_Aga
Milan - ITALY

 

[Clint]

I've always heard those few elements (not all traces) are bad so I don't risk it.

I know one way to find out..

Miracid isn't really any better than what you're already using. Even if it was, since you will be (or should be) diluting it so much and possible benefits which miracid would provide over anything else (which for the record, it doesn't. Just a little acidic) would be negligable.

 

[tonyc]

Glider 14
Most of that thread is written by people who don't have the most basic grasp of biology.
It's essentially worthless.
Sorry.
T.

 

[Clint]

Thank you very much for your kind words, Tonyc.

Like I said in the other thread. Are those elements harmful? Yes. Are they harmful in such low doses as these? Maybe. Maybe now, maybe it takes a while for them to build up. Why risk it? I think you are worrying over nothing. Pop a few crickets (or gouramis lmao) in there once in awhile if you are really worried about little wickle tiny elements that are only required in very small doses.

 

[Tony Paroubek]

Not trying to pick on anyone so noone take this the wrong way.. I am a scientist at heart and through education.  I read that other thread and have yet to see more than a couple people say simply that copper and zinc are toxic to cps or specifically to Nepenthes.  I have not seen any direct evidence to support those claims or any kind of qualifications that would lend credit to such claims.

There is a reason copper and zinc are included in microelement formulations.  They are both part of important plant enzymes.  So yes plants DO need them.  The question though is do you need to supplement with them?  And if you do, how much is too much because they can become toxic if too much is given.  I must say I find it amusing to read some of the other statements   is toxic.  Not one of them mentioned Boron though which is somewhat unclear how it works in a plant and according to my text book clearly states has an extreamly narrow range between deficiency and toxicity, much more so than either copper or zinc.

As for my own beliefs on this subject.  There is no clear answer.  It depends alot on an individuals circumstances.  What the plants are potted in, the kind of water used, any feeding the plants receive etc.  Plants must be fed, whether they are carnivorous plants or not.  If they are unable to catch sufficient amounts of their own food then it must be supplimented in some fashion.  This includes macro, micro and trace elements when appropriate.  So how would you go about deciding when it is appropriate to apply micro/trace elements?  Again it depends on each individual.  I think that there are a number of cases where plants are grown indoors in enclosed grow chambers, potted in mix which does not contain any nutrients, and watered with very pure water.  Such plants will benefit highly from external feeding.  Simply putting organic food into the pitchers on a regular basis would meet all the plants macro,micro and trace element requirements.  Feeding with dilute inorganic fertilizer not containing added micro/trace elements however would potentially cause a deficiency in micro and trace elements.  But feeding with the same dilute inorganic fertilizer using tap water instead of pure water would compensate and more than make up needed minor and trace elements!  Such a simple thing as changing the type of water can make a big impact.

Tony

 

[Clint]

I believe the notion that zinc was toxic came from dead plants in zinc baskets. Anything like that would be toxic for sure at that dose.

Just don't baby them too much. Everytime I baby something I kill it. It's like that infomercial, Set it and forget it!