Inorganic soil mix for Nepenthes

[cpjungle72]

Hello,
I am wanting to compose an all inorganic mix for my Nepenthes, based on the directions @: http://www.carnivorousplants.org/cpn/samples/Cult292NepInorSub.htm
And was wondering if anyone is using this mix, or using something similar? And where I can find all the ingredients for it? As I am having problems locating the product called Seramis here in the US. The product is made by a company based in the UK @ http://www.seramishydroponics.com/index.php/cName/seramis-clay-granules.
I have sent them an e-mail to see if they had a US supplier, or if I could arrange to have it shipped to the States, but have yet to receive a reply. Could I substitute the Seramis for something else, like Aerolite? For the Lecaton expanded clay perls, I have ordered a product called LECA Stone (8-16mm). It was the closest thing I could find to it. And also about the lava gravel, can I use any kind of lava, or should it be the black kind? Because I was thanking I could buy a bag of landscaping lava, and use a hammer to brake it up. I can buy large bag of the red lava for less then $5.
Any advice, or info would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks

 

[phissionkorps]

You can grow them in anything you want that doesn't leach chemicals or too many nutrients. You could grow them in broken glass if you want to. or pieces of carpet, or plastic, or whatever. They're really not too picky about their mix, provided you can keep highlands drier and lowlands wetter. I grow neps in all sorts of nonsense. I use red lava rock, perlite (which is just another kind of lava rock...), vermiculite, clay pellets, a bit of hydroton, and charcoal. And that's the inorganic stuff. I also use peat, about 4 different kinds of wood, LFS as a topdressing, and some other stuff I can't think of ATM.

 

[Fryster]

Is that Seramis the same as Fuller's earth? Kinda sounds like it......

 

[cpjungle72]

Thanks for the advice phissionkrops! So I could substitute the Seramis without a problem then. Sweet! The main reason I was intrigued with using a mix like this, is because it would have excellent air circulation and water retention, and it would never brake down. This mix can be used over, and over again even after repoting.

@Fryster, hi from what I have read about Seramis, it is processed in much the same way as LECA Stone, but instead of being round granules as the LECA stone is, Seramis has irregular aggregates. Both products are fired at very high temperatures causing them to expand with thousands of air pockets. So Fuller's earth (oil dri/cat litter) would work as well! Thanks for the tip.

 

[srduggins]

I used the small red lava rock you can find at home depot, the expanded clay balls used for orchids/hydroponics, laterite (found at aquarium stores) and osmocote to grow a mirabilis for over a year. The plant grew well but eventually died from lack of watering. Probably not the best species to try the mix on, but it was what I had at the time.

 

[cpjungle72]

I used the small red lava rock you can find at home depot, the expanded clay balls used for orchids/hydroponics, laterite (found at aquarium stores) and osmocote to grow a mirabilis for over a year. The plant grew well but eventually died from lack of watering. Probably not the best species to try the mix on, but it was what I had at the time.

Thanks for the info! So I take it that this mix drys out really fast? I would need to water every day? When your N.mirabilis was growing in it, did it seem to grow better for you in this mix then if it where in an organic mix? Sorry for all the questions. I just want to be sure that an inorganic mix would be worth the extra expense, and time spent caring for. Oh yes, and the plants that I will be using this mix for are my, N.truncata, and N.sanguinea. Both plants are very young, and in a coconut chip/coco peat mix. Thank they would do alright? They are pretty tough plants.
Thanks for the help!

 

[phissionkorps]

Truncata would be perfect for that mix. I water my truncatas like....twice a month. Seriously.
Both are in fir bark/perlite/charcoal

 

[cpjungle72]

Truncata would be perfect for that mix. I water my truncatas like....twice a month. Seriously.
Both are in fir bark/perlite/charcoal

Sweet! Thanks for the tip! So truncatas like it a bit dryer then other Nepenthes ssp?

 

[phissionkorps]

Apparently. I was giving them a little squirt every 3 or so days, and the edges of the leaves started turning yellow. I turned that into once a week, adn they still did. I kept extending the time until they looked happy, and it ended up being about once every two weeks. I guess you grow them more like a succulent lol.

What part of Oklahoma are you in btw? I'm headed up to Norman in an hour or so until Monday

 

[cpjungle72]

Hi phissionkorps, I am form Seminole, OK. It is about 60 mi east of OKC. Well I have had my truncata for about 3 weeks now, and have been giving it a misting of rain water every three days tell it runs out the bottom. So far it seems happy with it, and growing. I have both my Nep's in an east window that gets 5 hours of direct morning sun, and indirect the rest of the day. They seem to love there new home.

 

[srduggins]

So that's what I'm doing wrong with my truncata, I'm watering it.

The mix actually holds water for a couple days but if you miss watering it the plant will suffer. I put a saucer underneath to hold a little water so I wouldn't have to be so precise when I water. It wouldn't hurt to water every day with this mix.

I water every day with my current mix of cedar bark/mulch, pumice and orchid bark except when it is cloudy and cool.

 

[cpjungle72]

Thanks srduggins for the info. Yes everything I have read about soilless mixes, stated that it was almost imposable to over water. The mix drains so well you would have to submerge the pot before that would be a problem. So the main draw back with using this mix is that it drys out really fast. That would be a big problem if you had to be away from home for even two days. I am guessing that is what happened with your mirabilis? But I would thank that by setting the pot in some water as you stated, it would probably buy you a few extra days in a case like that. Well I have already ordered the LECA expanded clay, and some Aerolite (extra large perlite, more like pumice). So I am going to give it a try! So my mix well be 1 part LECA, 1 part red lava, 1 part Aerolite, 1 part laterite, and a bit of osmocote. It will probably be a few weeks before I have everything rounded up, but I will post before & after pics after I get them transplanted! Thanks to all for the advice, and info! You are all greatly appreciated!

 

[cpjungle72]

Well my Lecastone, and Aerolite arrived today! And I did some calling around, and was finely able to get some black lava stone! Wow that stuff is hard to find in my area! I called like six different nursery's, and garden centers before I finely found a source. So now all I need is the laterite, and I'll be in business!
I also picked up some Osmocote, but I thank I grabbed the wrong kind. The kind I got is for acid lovers, azalea/camellia/rhododendron. And the N P K is 9-6-6 with 18.7% Sulfur, and 2% Iron? Is anyone experienced with working with this stuff? Will this type be bad for my Nep's? I would be sick if I fried my Nep's!:-(
Thanks for anyones advice.

 

[cpjungle72]

Update

Well after getting all the ingredients for my inorganic mix, I decided to experiment with it before actually planting my Nep's in it to see how fast it dried out in between waterings, and/or anything else that could be wrong with it...
<a href="http://s65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/?action=view&current=Inorganicmix01.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/Inorganicmix01.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

For the test plants I used some cuttings of pothos vines that I took a month or so back as the ginepigs. Up until now they have been in strait water, and where just starting to develop new roots.

Poor things..:-(
<a href="http://s65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/?action=view&current=Testplant01.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/Testplant01.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

I have had the cuttings in the inorganic mix for three days now, and there are two things that have changed my mind about going with this all inorganic mix. For one thing the mix drys out way to fast! I have been having to water at least twice a day to keep the stuff moist. That would be a bad deal if I had to be away on a trip or something, I would have to have someone babysit them the whole time wile I was away or they would dehydrate! And the worst thing I have discovered is that the mix is so lite that every time you move the pot even a little, the mix shifts around, and makes a sound like two sheets of sand paper being rubbed together! I don't believe that my Nep's would appreciate there roots being sanded on every time I wanted to move there pots!
So what I have decided to do is to mix it into LFS for added water retention.

The mix is 1 part sphagnum, and 1 part of the inorganic mix.
<a href="http://s65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/?action=view&current=Growingmedia01.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/Growingmedia01.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
My sanguinea blood red form in a 3" pot on 2/14/08, the day after I received it.
before shot
<a href="http://s65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/?action=view&current=IMG_0351.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/IMG_0351.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

and after, in a modified 6" hanging basket with the new mix.
2/26/08 these sanguinea's are sure enouth fast growers!
<a href="http://s65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/?action=view&current=Nsanguinea.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/Nsanguinea.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

<a href="http://s65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/?action=view&current=Nsanguinea2.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/Nsanguinea2.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

My truncata in a 4" pot on 1/29/08, the day after receiving it.
before shot
<a href="http://s65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/?action=view&current=MyNTruncata.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/MyNTruncata.jpg" border="0" alt="My N.Truncata"></a>

And after, in a modified 6" with the new mix.
2/26/08. it's color is looking better
<a href="http://s65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/?action=view&current=Ntruncata2.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/Ntruncata2.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

finly just now starting a new shute
<a href="http://s65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/?action=view&current=Ntruncata.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h211/picmon/Ntruncata.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

So far both plants haven't showed any signs of being traumatized by the new mix, or by being trasplanted. But I would thank that they should do well with the extra aeration of this mix, and the holy pots. But only time will tell.
I'll keep you updated.
Thanks

 

[phissionkorps]

That's quite a lot of LFS for an inorganic mix....
I was under the impression you were looking to go totally inorganic?

 

[MrFlyTrap2]

pk, I think you missed a paragraph. Due to his test run with the vine cutting, he didn't feel the use 100% inorganic was going to work and changed it to a ratio of 1:1 LFS to inorganic.

 

[cpjungle72]

Yes I was originally, but I found the mix to be coarse, and abrasive by itself. Even wile it was wet it shifted around in the pot. I was afraid the roots of my plants would be damaged by the mix grinding on it. So I added in the LFS as a buffer/stabilizer so to speak.

 

[phissionkorps]

Ah I see. It was hard to read the text with those magnum sized pictures resizing the page.

 

[jrod]

Just cut up or shred a sponge, and use that in place of LFS. They both hold about the same amount of water, but the sponge is completely inorganic, and won't break down the way LFS will after a while. I'm looking into similar mixes to use for Heliamphora. If anybody has a good source for the expanded clay pellets, I'd love it if you could PM me!

 

[phissionkorps]

Dude sponges are animals