TerraForums Venus Flytrap, Nepenthes, Drosera and more talk
Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
My Nepenthes
- Thread starter morbus
- Start date
Dragoness
For the love of Science!
Depending on how your outdoor plants are set up, you may be able to keep the ants off of them if you want to/ Self-feeding plants are nice and all, but bugs can sometimes be a problem.
Do those things the ants make seem to have any negative effect on your pitchers?
If your Neps are in hanging baskets not touching the ground or other plants, they make something called a water moat that is used to keep ants out of things like hummingbird feeders. It is simply a little cup of water that your chain attaches to above and below that the ants supposedly can't cross. Something similar may be practical if you don't want the ants on your neps. I guess it depends on the ant species, as some will form rafts to cross bodies of water.
Do those things the ants make seem to have any negative effect on your pitchers?
If your Neps are in hanging baskets not touching the ground or other plants, they make something called a water moat that is used to keep ants out of things like hummingbird feeders. It is simply a little cup of water that your chain attaches to above and below that the ants supposedly can't cross. Something similar may be practical if you don't want the ants on your neps. I guess it depends on the ant species, as some will form rafts to cross bodies of water.
Sarah, why do you reckon I should get rid of them?
I have an 'open' greenhouse and, without continually spraying pesticides, it would be impossible to get rid of them long term.
Dragoness, I also think its a sort of safety structure. although, almost all my plants eat ants and they only seem to make them on some pitchers. it you look at the veitchii X bosch 'ant mound' closely, there is a hole in the front and the ants do move in and out of it. im not sure what that means, but its interesting. there could be a big nectar gland under it...
'the second pic I posted is just a ;plug' covering the opening. and, its the same type of ant building both. those are the only two structures I see them building on pitchers.
I dont believe there is a negative effect no. yesterday I saw that the plug in the second pic had somehow broken and most of it has fallen into the pitcher
honestly, I dont see any reason to get rid of them... I have had all sorts of bugs in the GH since it first went up (almost 5 years ago) and cant attribute any problem to them... and, they are a good food source. also, ive got around 180+ neps still in the GH and most are on the ground (see the first pic posted in the thread) so there is no way to prevent ant access to pitchers
I have an 'open' greenhouse and, without continually spraying pesticides, it would be impossible to get rid of them long term.
Dragoness, I also think its a sort of safety structure. although, almost all my plants eat ants and they only seem to make them on some pitchers. it you look at the veitchii X bosch 'ant mound' closely, there is a hole in the front and the ants do move in and out of it. im not sure what that means, but its interesting. there could be a big nectar gland under it...
'the second pic I posted is just a ;plug' covering the opening. and, its the same type of ant building both. those are the only two structures I see them building on pitchers.
I dont believe there is a negative effect no. yesterday I saw that the plug in the second pic had somehow broken and most of it has fallen into the pitcher
honestly, I dont see any reason to get rid of them... I have had all sorts of bugs in the GH since it first went up (almost 5 years ago) and cant attribute any problem to them... and, they are a good food source. also, ive got around 180+ neps still in the GH and most are on the ground (see the first pic posted in the thread) so there is no way to prevent ant access to pitchers
Dexenthes
Aristoloingulamata
I would think the opportunity to study the relationship between the Ants and the Nepenthes would override any perceived revulsion one might feel about the appearance of the ant "nest". Isn't that why we grow these plants; to study their behavior and relationships to their environment?? Not every insect is a "pest" and not all insect activity has a negative impact on their host.
mato
BANNED
you must be unfamiliar with in situ lowii pitchers
ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!!
Bio
Plant Whisperer
That is why that reason was last. Personally I wouldn't be into potentially risking the pitchers to observe ants.
I get ants in the greenhouse all the time. Almost always they're nectar-feeding ants.
IMO the benefits:
--Free food... ants feed the plants
--Keeps leaf diseases down. The extrafloral nectaries are a source of sugary food for black mold and mildew. By eating and removing the sugar, the ants keep the leaves clean and I don't get ugly stuff marring the apprearance of the plants.
--Really, really, really cool to show to people. It is easy to say "N. bical lives in symbiosis with ants!" The minute people see it actually occurring, however, they are awestruck. I have seen this time and again.
Downside:
--Many nectar-feeding ants also farm pests like aphids, mealybugs, and scale, which make sugary excretions. They will truck nymphs of these pests into the greenhouse through small cracks and deposit them on the plants. Minor annoyance for me, compared to the sense of wonder you experience at seeing the mutualism right before your eyes.
IMO the benefits:
--Free food... ants feed the plants
--Keeps leaf diseases down. The extrafloral nectaries are a source of sugary food for black mold and mildew. By eating and removing the sugar, the ants keep the leaves clean and I don't get ugly stuff marring the apprearance of the plants.
--Really, really, really cool to show to people. It is easy to say "N. bical lives in symbiosis with ants!" The minute people see it actually occurring, however, they are awestruck. I have seen this time and again.
Downside:
--Many nectar-feeding ants also farm pests like aphids, mealybugs, and scale, which make sugary excretions. They will truck nymphs of these pests into the greenhouse through small cracks and deposit them on the plants. Minor annoyance for me, compared to the sense of wonder you experience at seeing the mutualism right before your eyes.
I fully agree with the curiosity of it. my history with these plants is one of curiosity, so, im quite happy to see nature unfold in my GH; albeit very basic. I would love to have a tree shrew frolicking on my imaginary vining lowii, lol
to be honest though, I havent considered the possibility of them carrying nasties into my GH. I have only ever had scale once but I believe that that was isolated and a plant problem rather than an ant problem. touch wood. but I will keep an eye out for it, thanks!
While I havent done any reading into possible reasons for this; the ants in the pictures are Argentinian which means that they cannot know what Neps are and these cannot be Nep specific behaviors. so, I am curious as to why they would build these structures? rather, why do they know how to and that they should... and why only sometimes?
And, I dont think its unattractive there are 100 untouched pitchers for every one that gets built on.
as theplantman said, its really cool to be able to show someone a pitcher full of digesting bugs, and as the pic below shows - the mechanism that they have to keep the prey inside im still amazed
what happens when they dont build
to be honest though, I havent considered the possibility of them carrying nasties into my GH. I have only ever had scale once but I believe that that was isolated and a plant problem rather than an ant problem. touch wood. but I will keep an eye out for it, thanks!
While I havent done any reading into possible reasons for this; the ants in the pictures are Argentinian which means that they cannot know what Neps are and these cannot be Nep specific behaviors. so, I am curious as to why they would build these structures? rather, why do they know how to and that they should... and why only sometimes?
And, I dont think its unattractive
there are 100 untouched pitchers for every one that gets built on.as theplantman said, its really cool to be able to show someone a pitcher full of digesting bugs, and as the pic below shows - the mechanism that they have to keep the prey inside
im still amazed what happens when they dont build
I fully agree with the curiosity of it.
*edit*
While I havent done any reading into possible reasons for this; the ants in the pictures are Argentinian which means that they cannot know what Neps are and these cannot be Nep specific behaviors. so, I am curious as to why they would build these structures? rather, why do they know how to and that they should... and why only sometimes?
And, I dont think its unattractive
as theplantman said, its really cool to be able to show someone a pitcher full of digesting bugs, and as the pic below shows - the mechanism that they have to keep the prey inside
What happens in the pitcher, stays in the pitcher
I fully agree with the curiosity of it. my history with these plants is one of curiosity, so, im quite happy to see nature unfold in my GH; albeit very basic. I would love to have a tree shrew frolicking on my imaginary vining lowii, lol
to be honest though, I havent considered the possibility of them carrying nasties into my GH. I have only ever had scale once but I believe that that was isolated and a plant problem rather than an ant problem. touch wood. but I will keep an eye out for it, thanks!
While I havent done any reading into possible reasons for this; the ants in the pictures are Argentinian which means that they cannot know what Neps are and these cannot be Nep specific behaviors. so, I am curious as to why they would build these structures? rather, why do they know how to and that they should... and why only sometimes?
And, I dont think its unattractive
as theplantman said, its really cool to be able to show someone a pitcher full of digesting bugs, and as the pic below shows - the mechanism that they have to keep the prey inside
what happens when they dont build
I am extremely curious as to how the ants solved the problem of creating a bridge using debris and soil, and how they knew it would stick to the Nep leaf. Perhaps, like bees and wasps (their relatives!), they're able to create biological glues or have special saliva.
I believe what I've got are also Argentinian ants, which are currently invading the southern US. Because I have such a diverse collection crammed in one greenhouse, almost every plant family other than carnivores is preferred by pests. Typically they farm mealybugs on the other plants, and all they do on the carnivores is harmlessly sip nectar. Apparently these ants are also attracted to electromagnetism. I have found milions of ants nesting inside my drip irrigation control boxes ($200 worth of ant-related failure!). We've also lost a computer to Argentinian ants as well as a cooling unit for a walk-in fridge.
I also agree with morbus. Nepenthes always have more than one leaf and more than one pitcher. Plenty of spares if the ants colonize one or even several.
Sarah, I think that a Nep producing nectar will make any ant problem worse, lol. they will just come for it in force and the plant wont trap them all.
Paul, the need to make sure nothing gets out or they may let the others know its a trap, lol. such sneaky plants!
the plot thickens. I have no idea how they build it... a while ago, they made one that spanned about 5cm. pity I dont have a picture though.
So, we get them in electronics here as well, but that just happens in winter. I think its the heat they are after as it just happens for us in winter. have you sealed the box?? $200 is quite a lot... thats an eddie
Paul, the need to make sure nothing gets out or they may let the others know its a trap, lol. such sneaky plants!
the plot thickens. I have no idea how they build it... a while ago, they made one that spanned about 5cm. pity I dont have a picture though.
So, we get them in electronics here as well, but that just happens in winter. I think its the heat they are after as it just happens for us in winter. have you sealed the box?? $200 is quite a lot... thats an eddie
Last edited:
