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Thread: How old is too old?

  1. #65
    Lechenaultia's Avatar
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    Dr. Jan Schlauer answered my question.

    Konnichiwa!

    Jan-san (Dr. Jan Schlauer), who has been a good friend of mine since I joined the cp-listserve in 1994, answered my question.
    ......
    Regarding the seed coat, this is the commonly used term. The external form and the mechanical properties of the seed are defined by the outer layer that is called testa. Additionally the embryo is included in the inner (protective) layer that is called tegmen and is a thin membranous peel in Nepenthes. Other seeds have endosperm that additionally surrounds the embryo, but in Nepenthes the endosperm is not well developed or lacking whatsoever.
    ......

    Kind regards from the Far East

    Quote Originally Posted by Lechenaultia View Post
    I call what I removed the Nepenthes seed husk. Some members on TF call it the Nepenthes seed coat. I am not familiar with the technical terms. The membrane that I provisionally call it the seed coat still wraps the actual seed, except the one end where the root will be emerging. It still seems to protect the seed.
    I illustrate it by using the peanut though it is improper.
    Attachment 4082
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/879/40...cfc721f7_o.jpg
    Nepenthes eymae: the part that put a red ring around, the membrane doesn't exist originally there.
    Attachment 4083
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/819/41...9b0ef693_o.jpg
    Peanut: the part that put a red ring around, I artificially removed the coat.

  2. #66
    Lechenaultia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acro View Post
    It's late, and I'm sleepy, so I may not be thinking clearly but . . .
    Could it be that old seedlings don't have the strength to push through their seed hull? And when stripped of their seed hull, their energy is focused on growth instead of the struggle to break free?
    Dear Acro-san,
    Konnichiwa!
    How old is too old?-20180306_204911-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4696/4...2f113456_o.jpg
    I took the photo on March 06 in 2018.
    After I took the above photo, I sowed these seeds. It seems the old seedlings have the strength to push through their seed husk.

    I took the following photos on April 12 in 2018.
    How old is too old?-20180412_224625-1-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/820/39...25b77101_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    How old is too old?-20180412_224625-2-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/863/41...69e377b6_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    How old is too old?-p4120005copy-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/883/41...ce733f42_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    Though I don't understand the conditions for the appropriate storage of the Nepenthes seeds, it seems viability among Nepenthes seeds is a lot longer than what we may think and have/may read, as N_CloudySkies-san said.

    Quote Originally Posted by N_CloudySkies View Post
    Hello Lechenaultia,
    I personally think that you may find seed viability will always tend to be a bit longer than you expect, I think viability among most all nepenthes seeds is a lot longer than what we may think and have/may read. I just never imagined something like N. eymae seeds from 2013......that is incredible. I would love to see those with far better skills than I answer that question just "how old is too old". That would be a very good thing for world-wide seed banks and preservation efforts for nepenthes? Just really positive.
    Kind regards from the Far East

  3. #67

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    Have the tentative pitchers grown at all? Do we have any recent pictures? I really want to know if these are actually nepenthes.
    The worst thing [about being an adult] is when you realize that oreos are just OK
    --Zach Weinersmith

  4. #68
    Lechenaultia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by schmiggle View Post
    Have the tentative pitchers grown at all? Do we have any recent pictures? I really want to know if these are actually nepenthes.
    Dear Schmiggle-san,
    Konnichiwa!
    Please see the photos again.
    How old is too old?-20180412_224625-7-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/791/39...967bf4e3_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)
    How old is too old?-20180412_224625-6-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/790/40...5f30632e_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    Kind regards from the Far East
    Last edited by Lechenaultia; 04-12-2018 at 02:25 PM.

  5. #69
    Lechenaultia's Avatar
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    Update 05

    Update 05
    I took the photos on April 12 in 2018.
    How old is too old?-20180412_224625-3-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/884/41...036af679_b.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)
    How old is too old?-20180412_224625-4-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/799/41...8f0ba656_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)
    How old is too old?-20180412_224625-5-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/882/27...90c89d6b_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)
    Last edited by Lechenaultia; 04-12-2018 at 02:25 PM.

  6. #70

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    Well, if these aren't nepenthes then they're something truly bizarre.
    The worst thing [about being an adult] is when you realize that oreos are just OK
    --Zach Weinersmith

  7. #71
    Lechenaultia's Avatar
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    Update 06

    Update 06
    I took the photos on May 16 in 2018.

    How old is too old?-20180516_233528-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/960/28...0ef10887_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    How old is too old?-20180516_233607-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/979/42...1df1233d_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    How old is too old?-20180516_233333-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/948/42...b6986ece_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    How old is too old?-20180516_233429-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/958/27...afaefd24_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    How old is too old?-20180516_233639-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/973/28...388aab3b_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

  8. #72
    SirKristoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lechenaultia View Post
    Update 06
    I took the photos on May 16 in 2018.

    How old is too old?-20180516_233528-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/960/28...0ef10887_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    How old is too old?-20180516_233607-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/979/42...1df1233d_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    How old is too old?-20180516_233333-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/948/42...b6986ece_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    How old is too old?-20180516_233429-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/958/27...afaefd24_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)

    How old is too old?-20180516_233639-jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/973/28...388aab3b_o.jpg
    The germination from 5 years old Nepenthes eymae seeds (stored for 5 years in refrigerator)
    Incredible How old is too old?How old is too old?

    I have often pondered the idea of removing the seed coat from Nepenthes seed as well! This only makes me want to try more!
    Though treating your seeds with GA3 seems to help a lot as well, I am old school and sow my seeds intact on milled sphagnum.
    I have had seed as old as 1 year sprout, never tried.
    I feel there are several people here who owe you an apology for lashing and attacking without asking and jumping to conclusions. Assumption makes an *** of all of us.

    Thank you for the insight you have provided in this thread!

    Here is one of my most promising batches of seed right now, Nepenthes edwardsiana.
    Seed took 3 weeks to begin sprouting from time of sowing(March 1 2018), and were approximately 2 months old by the time I received them from a friend of mine.
    Last Wednesday they received their first maxsea feeding.




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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